The Slow Work of God
00:00:00 Matt: Welcome to another episode of here below. My name is Matt Wireman. I am one of the pastors at Christ the Redeemer Church in Greenville, South Carolina and has has been usual. I've got my friend and co-laborer in the gospel. Doctor Luke Stamps, who, uh, is a community group director. A faithful member, has been at Redeemer for several years. Took a hit the pause button for some for some travel and then came back. And so we are grateful and, and we have been doing these episodes of, here below in an effort to, as we say in the introduction to basically join our voices with the throng of witnesses that we hear about in Hebrews twelve that are cheering us along, and that here below we want to, redound to God's glory, and we want to reflect on what it means to not just, have a relationship with Christ, with, with, with God himself. but what does that relationship with God look like here below? Like, it's not just a faith that that saves us for some. For heaven, as it were. heaven is the new heavens and new earth. It's where. Where God himself will dwell in our presence. But as we don't get to see that in its consummate glory. Yet how do we live our lives here, below, in the everyday stuff of life and just the mundane and and one of the things we're releasing this in January of twenty twenty six. One of the things, I feel felt I was telling Luke before we hit record, felt inclined to have us talk about is, you know, during the month of January, folks are talking about new habits, new goals, which I personally love. And I do that myself. Um, but a lot of times within our goal setting, our new habit formation, we forget that the whole purpose of those is to become a different kind of person. now, Luke and I had a separate conversation before we started this podcast, and he shared with me a prayer by, Pierre Teilhard de Chardin and, forgive me, my my French ain't that good. And, but I thought it would be great, Luke, for us just to free for you to read that prayer and for us just to encourage folks. This is going to be a shorter episode today. We're going to just have variations on different things so that every episode isn't an hour long, but maybe just something to give you a little shot in the arm, a little encouragement, a little reminder, um, and to point your eyes towards Jesus. So, Luke, could you do us a favor of just reading that? And then we'll just, you know, as the spirit leads, reflect on some of the things even we can incorporate some of the things that we were talking about prior to, um, to recording. but at the very least, if you could go ahead and get us started off, that would be wonderful.
00:02:50 Luke: Yeah, sure. So, and I don't know a ton about, de Chardin. Um, I know he's a Jesuit priest, and and I think he was like a scientist, you know, as well, and, you know, a spiritual writer. Um, but, you know, one of the, one of the great things about the the truth is that it's not really dependent upon the source, you know? So, um, you know, there may be things about de Chardin that that would be problematic. And we're not endorsing him, but the truth of what he has to say can be discerned, by careful Bible readers. But anyway, the the, um, the prayer as it's written or as I found it is called patient trust. And it goes like this. Above all, trust in the slow work of God. We are quite naturally impatient in everything to reach the end without delay. We should like to skip the intermediate stages. We are impatient of being on the way to something unknown, something new. And yet it is the law of all progress that it is made by passing through some stages of instability, and that it may take a very long time. And so I think it is with you. Your ideas mature gradually. Let them grow. Let them shape themselves without undue haste. Don't try to force them on as though you could be to day. What time, that is to say, grace and circumstances acting on your own goodwill will make of you to morrow. Only God could say what this new spirit gradually forming within you will be. Give our Lord the benefit of believing that his hand is leading you, and accept the anxiety of feeling yourself in suspense and incomplete. So what do you think about that?
00:04:49 Matt: That's, um. That's a that's a prayer that I need to, remind myself of daily. There are two things. I'm looking at it here as well. This the beginning and the end are just, um, like, hit, hit, hit me right in the gut. Um, above all. So. So if you were to take the measure of all the different things that are happening in your life, this is what he's saying. Like you have to trust in the slow work of God. And then he says, give our Lord the benefit of believing that his hand is leading you, and accept the anxiety of feeling yourself in suspense and incomplete. That we are are always going to be incomplete until the great day when our Lord Jesus returns. That that, as Paul says on that day, right when we will see him face to face. And I think if we can get comfortable with being uncomfortable, we would we would do really well for ourselves. And I think inherent within that prayer in giving our Lord the benefit of believing that his hand is leading you, that in essence, we're we're trusting that the Lord is omnipresent and he's active in his creation and no less the case. He's active in our own individual lives. I think it's such a wonderful, beautiful prayer to start out twenty twenty six that we consider trust the slow work of God, right? I just, um, yeah, I, I have a couple more thoughts, but I'd love to hear just even as you were reading it in this moment, but then also even as you were reading it earlier this morning, um, any anything that, um, the Lord particularly calls to jump out at you?
00:06:32 Luke: Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I think it it's something that I've been learning slowly. Right. As as most things are as this, as this prayer expresses, is the importance of, um, the present. Right. Um, it's interesting to see like that, that even, you know, even sort of unbelieving psychologists and philosophers recognize by nature, by reason, what we also know from Scripture, the importance of being. mindfully present, right. Again, that we might think about that as kind of like a pop psychology trendy thing to say. But the Bible actually has a lot to say about this as well, right? And in all the world religions do as well. But the importance of being in the moment, right? Jesus says, um, take no thought for tomorrow. Right. Um, because the trouble of today is sufficient for itself, right? Um, the Bible says, you know, today is the day of salvation. Now is the accepted time, right? I mean, there's this emphasis in the scriptures and again, in all of the world religions and even in philosophy and psychology, these are things that are sort of universally recognized by human beings, that the present is all you you have. It's all that you will ever have. Um, in a way, the present is all that exists, right? If you follow or I mean, the past is gone, you can't undo the past. The future is not yet here. The present is all that you have. So anyway, that one thing that stood out to me was just a lesson that I've been learning slowly of of, just being mindfully present. Right. And that's what one of the lines that stood out to me most from this prayer was, don't try to force your ideas on as though you could be today. What time will make of you tomorrow? I'm, you know, kind of eliding, a line or two there. But don't try to be today. What? Only time can make you be tomorrow, right? Because we kind of want to force everything. different personality types might even be more prone to this than others, but we want to force everything now, right? and just letting go and being in the moment and trusting that slow work, you know, like the farmer who waits, you know, for the seeds to germinate and the crops to grow, um, is really hard, but it's also really freeing, you know, like, it's freeing to know.
00:09:03 Matt: Yeah, you don't have to worry about that. You don't have to worry about that particular issue that that may or may not crop up. Right. Yeah.
00:09:11 Luke: And that's exactly what Jesus says in that, in that text from from Matthew six. Um, how many of you, by worrying, can add an hour to your life or a cubit to your stature or whatever? Yeah. Um, worrying actually doesn't do anything. It sort of gives us the illusion that we're doing something.
00:09:28 Matt: It actually inhibits us from from not just from doing, but from becoming. Yeah. The kind of people that we need to be.
00:09:35 Luke: Yeah. Exactly. Right. It's it's yeah, it's it's not just unproductive. It's counterproductive to.
00:09:39 Matt: Worry.
00:09:40 Luke: But we think we're doing something when we worry. Like, as long as I'm worrying about it, you know, at least, you know, at least I'm doing something. No, you're actually not. You're not doing anything. And what you're doing isn't helping, you know? but just to sort of be, um, again, sort of, I don't know, this is kind of a buzzword, but again, there's some truth, of being mindfully present in the moment and trusting God that as David says, my times are in your hands. You know, the Lord has appointed every day they they're all written in a book. You know, they're all he's the one who who's in charge of all that. You know, my task is to practice his presence daily, moment by moment, to just be with the Lord. You know, not to leave him in my quiet time in the morning, but to take him with me right every moment of the day. and and just entrusting myself to his good providence, even when it's difficult.
00:10:30 Matt: Yeah. Yeah. I think one of the other things that, um, even as you're talking and what I was reflecting on is, is what, um, Desjardins is encouraging us, like, only God could say what this new spirit gradually forming within you will be. I think about my own life. Um, you know, when I was in first and second grade, I had a certain, Plan for my life, and it could have happened or it could have not happened, right? Um, I wanted to be a heart surgeon. I wanted to be a doctor, a medical doctor. And that would have been a wonderful thing. Because the Lord can. Because what the Lord is after in our own lives as his children, is the shaping of our soul. And all the other things are just tools in which he wants to shape our soul. So, you know, the the, the moments of learning humility, the moments of learning, trusting in God's love, um, that could be had if I was performing surgery. It could be had while I'm having a hard conversation with someone or writing that difficult email. Right. So. So the Lord uses all these tools because at the at the the end goal, as, as Paul says, this is God's will for your life, your sanctification. And what is that? Sanctification is simply Christ being formed in us. And so, so all of these, um, you know, accidents to use it in a technical way, all of these things that we experience in life are God's ways of getting at our essence, of who we are. And and so as you look at this new year of twenty twenty six, I want to encourage you. I'm talking to a listener and myself and you. But, um, I want to encourage, um, all of us to, to slow down long enough ourselves to, to be in step with the Spirit of God, that he's doing a slow work in our lives. And to be in step with the spirit oftentimes is to slow down, to be aware, to be present with the person that you're talking to, to be present with the moment that God gives you, that he, in fact, is shaping you into the image of his son, Jesus. Um, that's really what he's after. Like. Sure. Dropping thirty pounds this year. Great goal I have, right? Um, but what kind of person does that require me to be? It requires me to be a more self-controlled person. Helps me to be a more aware person as I'm eating. Helps. Helps me to also be present and say whatever I do, whether I eat or drink, do it all for the glory of God. And that that also relates to, you know, not giving to gluttony, not giving to sloth, not giving to, you know, any number of the vices and to, to cultivate in my own heart the virtues of charity, of of trust in what the Lord's doing in my life. So, so I think that that would be my prayer for all of us this twenty twenty six year is that we would, as my favorite book is called Practice the Presence of God. Um, that's all that's on my top. That'd be my top ten list. I probably need to write down a top ten list, because I say that about a lot of different books. That's my top ten. Well, it depends on the genre, but that definitely, out of all the books I've ever read in all of my life, top ten would be. Practice the Presence of God by Brother Lawrence, because I read that when I was in college and recommended on the regular and in fact, give it out, um, at our membership class. Um, because it is if if you let it do its work, it will reshape you into a different kind of person, not just, oh, I need to read more. I need to pray more. I need to serve more. Like, well, those will all be fruits. Even as we looked at on Sunday from Isaiah twenty seven, this, this, these fruits will happen in your life. But actually the the whole gravity, the gravitational pull is in is communion with God. And and in that moment, communing with him.
00:14:48 Luke: Yeah. The thing I love about that book is its simplicity. You know, if you get into reading spiritual theology. Um, it can get complicated. You know, like a lot of a lot of people, a lot of the mystical writers like we've talked about in previous episodes, and even the Puritans and spiritual writers like it gets very some of the processes can kind of get very complicated and that some of that's very helpful because like, life is complicated and we kind of need that granular, you know, detail in order to make sense out of what does it actually look like to grow in a fallen world, given indwelling sin and given the challenges of life? And so I'm not trying to dismiss more complicated pictures, but the thing I love about Brother Lawrence's book is, is like the method is so simple and like, we kind of need that simplicity sometimes the focus of just saying, like here, here's what it is. It's very simple. Recollect God's presence every moment and all of your tasks. Just take him with you, right? He's already with you anyway. he's already attending to Yeah. The goal is just to turn your gaze back to him and attend to him as he's with you. Whenever you wash the dishes, as he's with you, whenever you travel, you know, to the next town to buy wine. These are the kinds of things that he talks about doing, right? Um, in terms of practicing God's presence, I'm remembering the book. Right. Isn't isn't that.
00:16:13 Matt: Yeah. Yeah, yeah. The particular one for me that was that was just profound was the washing of dishes. I was like, there ain't no way you're practicing God's presence. And you're like, yeah. When you are there and realizing that I am, I can be with God right now. Yeah. Because we oftentimes look at our lives as just sheer tasks as opposed to the shaping of our soul.
00:16:35 Luke: Yeah. And most people have a kind of internal dialogue anyway. they're kind of talking to themselves and, you know, there's layers of thought going on. Um, so for a Christian, like, the goal is to just take that internal dialogue that we all have as we're planning our day, thinking about our anxieties. You know, it's just to sort of remember God is in there, right? God. God is present in that internal dialogue. And just to make it, um, not a monologue, but a dialogue to just, you know, just talk to God throughout the day. Thank him, you know, for things as they appear in your life. Um, I mean, I feel like that's one of the best ways to practice God's presence, honestly, is just being grateful, right? Just kind of things that, you don't even think about. Like, you know, my car cranked this morning, crunk. Whatever you make that.
00:17:26 Matt: I think crunk is a kind of dance.
00:17:28 Luke: Yeah. My car cranked this morning.
00:17:31 Matt: Yeah. Cranked? Yeah.
00:17:32 Luke: You know, and it was very cold. And there was heat that kept me warm in the very short commute. I have to work, um, you know, to just remember to give thanks, like, give thanks to God for for things that happen in your life, even for the difficulties that happen in your life. Um, gratitude, I think, is a is just one of the ways we can practice God's presence the best. Um, but just to invite God in to that, you know, that internal conversation that we're already having, and that's how you pray without ceasing. I mean, I think I remember being young and I thought, well, that's obviously an exaggeration. You know, like, you know, like, this is hyperbolic. You know, he doesn't really mean pray without ceasing. He just means having a posture of prayer or whatever, you know, like I but like having read Brother Lawrence, I realized, no, like, you can actually pray without ceasing, you know? I mean, obviously I have to stop and talk to you in this podcast. I'm going to go teach a class in a minute, you know, so I'm going to have to talk to other people. And you have tasks you have to do. so yes, there's some truth in that posture of prayer approach. But like, you can pray on your way to on your way to work, you can pray even in the middle of a conversation.
00:18:44 Matt: Yeah, Lord, give me the words to say. Give me, give me. You know.
00:18:48 Luke: I mean, like, I remember noticing this in Nehemiah, Um, years ago, reading, doing a Bible study through Nehemiah. And whenever he's interacting with the king, he's praying like that. He would have the the right words to say, you know, um, back to the, to the king. And so you can pray even in the conversation. You can pray in between tasks. You can pray when you're going to the bathroom. You know what I mean? Like, like you, you can pray, all the time, you know, and I think that's just having, you know, learning the discipline of that, I feel like is one of the, the, the great benefits of that book. That is actually what helps you to do the thing that we began with. Right, which is in in the slow progress of our sanctification, in the difficulties and uncertainties of life, what are we going to do? Well, we the only thing we really can do is trust God's providence. And the only way that that cashes out is in this moment by moment dependence upon him.
00:19:46 Matt: Yeah. I've got, two Analogies to images. I wanted to briefly share maybe one humorous, one hopefully helpful, but the first one like, Luke, you, for those that know, you know that you love barbecue, you love making barbecue. And so would it be preferable if I had a, you know, a lamb shank or, you know, what do you do? What do you what do you what's your favorite thing to barbecue?
00:20:14 Luke: You know, I do pork shoulder roasts and brisket. Those are the things I do most.
00:20:19 Matt: So if I were to want to get involved in that, um, would it be beneficial for me to turn the grill up to four fifty and just kind of throw it on if I've, if I've got, you know, the game? I forgot about it. The game is starting in an hour. I need this thing done. What would happen if I were to do that?
00:20:41 Luke: Yeah. You dry that thing out. Yeah. It's not going to be good unless it goes low and slow all the way. That's a great, great illustration.
00:20:48 Matt: Yes. Maybe we'll have an episode where we just only talk about barbecue and just pull all of the the spiritual ramifications, especially when you patience and four, four sites and, all the things that are involved. But we could maybe do that some other time.
00:21:07 Luke: I could really play around with that because, you know, all the details about, you know, there actually are some ways to speed up the cook time, even when you're going low and slow by rapping, you know, eventually whenever it hits a stall, you wrap it up or butcher paper to help.
00:21:22 Matt: That'll preach.
00:21:23 Luke: So I'm thinking, you know, there's gotta be some sermon illustrations in there.
00:21:28 Speaker 3: Wrap your life in foil.
00:21:30 Luke: Yeah.
00:21:31 Speaker 3: Wait, don't.
00:21:32 Matt: Um. The other, the other image I got was, um. So. Yeah. So actually, we'll put a pin on that. Maybe we'll have a little fun episode where we talk about barbecue. If you want that to happen, just send us an email here below at Redeemer Greenville dot com. Say yes to the barbecue. So, maybe we'll have, you know, some debates going on. Some mustard and ketchup based and vinegar, all the, all the different things that I'm not aware of. But, I do love barbecue as well. And, but I'm not the connoisseur as you are. But the other image I got was a lot of times in parenting, the encouragement that we got from older folk and that I would give to, younger folk is my oldest, is now a freshman in college. Um, and, you know, I'm a little bit further down the road. It this was the encouragement, especially as they're toddlers, as they're, you know, bumbling around, figuring out things, um, and then as they start to form logic and reason, you know, at their six and seven year old self or the or or even at, at, at the teenage level in some ways, right, of saying, why did you think that that was going to work that way? And the encouragement was this don't expect a thirteen year old or a five year old or a ten year old to have a thirty year old's mind. Don't expect, that to for them to be able to reason like that and not only reason like that, but then to be able to have have the experience of, oh, if I say this to this person, then this will probably result. But let people be formed and shape through time and trust the process, and continually show up for your kids to be able to guide them in that process. But I think for us, the by way of analogy is don't expect the sixty five year old Matt Wireman to show up as the forty seven year old Matt Wireman. And and so forth. Because because I can I can be prone towards guilt and frustration. By the way, I did did my parenting, for example, or like, man, I wish I would have been more patient. Well, I'm more patient now because of the hard work of learning and of and of repenting and of asking for forgiveness. Um, and I think also for us, like, hopefully by God's grace. Right. Changing from one degree of glory to another, by God's grace. January twenty twenty six Matt Wyman and Luke Stamps will be different than December twenty twenty six. Luke Stamps and Matt Wyman. And that's all of God's grace. And to realize that, as we are communing with God and cooperating with His Spirit, who who dwells within us indeed is nearer than our own soul, that, he wants to shape our soul and we have no clue. That's the that's that's that can be anxiety producing, or it can be really awesome if you trust the one who's guiding you. Right. Like, man, what kind of person will I be if I am communing with God and and prioritizing my relationship with him. What kind of person would I be after twelve months of doing that day after day? Holy moly, that that could be a really amazing person and I want to be that person. And trusting the Lord in that process of creating that person. So that's my encouragement to all, all y'all who are faithfully listening. And, um, it's an encouragement to our church as well as to those who are are listening on the periphery. We want to encourage you that that God is working in you to create a certain kind of person, and we have no idea what that is. But if we can trust that as we are with him in that process, that it's going to be really beautiful.
00:25:22 Luke: Mm. Yeah. There's a, there's, there's, there's joy in letting go and freedom in that and recognizing like. It's not just it's not to excuse sloth right. Or inaction but but in our striving after God to know that everything is ultimately in his hands, you know that we can't manufacture transformation in our lives. We can't manufacture transformation in someone else's life. we're dependent upon God, and God is going to do it his way and his timing and and just kind of being okay with that, not never being okay with sin, you know, like, but being okay with God's providence, um, and resting in that gives you freedom and joy.
00:26:13 Matt: Yeah. Yeah. Well, let me close this in a word of prayer. And then we will put a cap on this episode. Heavenly father, we thank you for the great privilege it is to be your children. We thank you for the great privilege it is to have friends, and we thank you for the great privilege it is to be a part of your family. God, we ask that during this year that you would help us, that you would reorient our hearts, that you would focus our attention at tending to you, that we would put our attention to you as we go about our days, as we fill spreadsheets, as we respond to emails, as we have wonderful and difficult conversations, we ask God that you would make us aware of your presence, that we would trust the slow work that you are doing in our hearts because you are trying to change us on the inside. You are reconstituting our loves, your reorienting our hearts, your your, your transforming our minds, Lord. And that takes time. And we pray that we would trust you in that process, no matter where we are in our pilgrimage with you, that we would trust you as we follow you as our guide and as the Shepherd of our souls. We pray this in Jesus name. Amen.